Influencers Transcript: Sukhinder Singh Cassidy, August 1, 2019

ANDY SERWER: Sukhinder Singh Cassidy has seemingly always had a knack for business. Tanzanian-born, she started working in her father's medical practice in Ontario at the early age of seven. After years of working in the financial sector on Wall Street for Merrill Lynch, and in London, for British Sky broadcasting, Singh Cassidy sought a new challenge-- moving to Silicon Valley to take on the tech world. Over the last 20 years, she held numerous leadership and executive roles for the likes of Amazon, Accel, and Google.

Last year, Singh Cassidy was named president of StubHub-- the world's largest online ticket exchange marketplace-- owned by eBay. While Singh Cassidy says half of her life is about entrepreneurship, the other half is dedicated to empowering a future generation of women business leaders around the world.

ANDY SERWER: Hello. Welcome to "Influencers." I'm Andy Serwer. And welcome to our guest, Sukhinder Singh Cassidy, who is the president of StubHub. Sukhinder, great to see you.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Good to see you again.

ANDY SERWER: There's so much to talk about-- your job, your career, your company-- but I have to ask you, because you've worked in big tech for a number of years now-- and of course, big tech is in the spotlight right now, or in the cross-hairs of Washington. Do you think that big tech is a problem-- and the problem is something that Washington needs to address?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Well, I think-- as opposed to whether Washington needs to address it or not-- let's talk about the three characteristics of big tech that are relevant right now. Number one, continue to be innovators and no one would debate the need for innovation-- let's hope, right? But I think in the cross-hairs of big tech is user privacy and use of data, and is that an issue that needs to be forefront for everyone? For sure, right?

I mean, I as a consumer, you as a consumer, we would all say, hey, we want to have control over what's done with our data. And so I think it's appropriate that we're taking a look at that issue. Other big issue in big tech right now is antitrust. And I would say, generally speaking-- kind of at StubHub, at eBay-- we believe in democratic platforms, but platforms in which we don't set ourselves up to compete with our customers.

And when I look at big tech, I think one of the things that I think about in the antitrust realm is the fact that many of the big tech companies are both providers of services to companies like mine-- but quite frankly, have the risk of using our data to build competitive services-- and so I do think that the focus on platforms that both control access to users-- not only have access to user information, but they are a platform for many other companies to do business, at the same time, are a threat of using that data to compete with the companies they serve.

So one of the things I think about is how to make sure that the platforms both can do good in the world-- but A, be mindful of customer data and privacy. And number two, think about that construct between being a platform for other companies to thrive, but being very careful on making sure that they don't use their unique advantage-- in being the platform for other companies-- to, in fact, set themselves up to compete with their customers.

ANDY SERWER: So if there are these issues, though, Sukhinder, how are they going to be resolved? I mean, is it the place for Washington to step in? I mean, the tech companies say, we can self regulate. That probably isn't working right now.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Yep. I would say a couple of things. I think that people often go to regulation and self-regulate. And I think there is a path in between-- which is monitor, be aware, be educated. And I think does the government have a role to play in making sure that there are policies, user education, and they themselves are monitoring? Yes. Do I think that we need to mandate regulation right now? That's not clear to me.

What is clear is that attention needs to be paid, and I don't think you can just trust that these things will unfold as they should through pure self-regulation. I mean, by the way, I'd say the same thing about boards. You can just say, hey everybody should do the right thing. But people, although well-intended, it doesn't always just flow that way. So I'm not sure I would go to the extreme of everybody needs to be regulated, but I am in favor of monitoring and advocacy work that the government is involved in.

ANDY SERWER: And eBay, you mentioned, the owner of StubHub-- your company-- they're a platform too.


ANDY SERWER: You obviously have customer data--


ANDY SERWER: -- because people log in.


ANDY SERWER: But you don't use the data the same way that some of the other platforms do?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Well, I think you're hitting a couple key things. First of all, I think every customer in the world is trusting us to be good stewards of their data. And a commerce company is not different from an advertising company in that regard. But what is different is the business model involves the taking of customer information.

People know they're giving their information when they buy a ticket. And they're trusting me to be stewards of their address, their credit card information. We have a lot of trust in safety that we take. But I think there is something about commerce-- where it's very visible what information you are giving in order to enable a transaction.

I think one of the reasons that platform companies that are in the advertising space seem more hard to grasp-- because the user isn't clear what data is being collected and for what purpose. And so I think there's a beauty to commerce-- which it's pretty clear why you're-- why and for what purpose you collect data. Regardless, I think we all have a responsibility to be good stewards of the data we collect.

ANDY SERWER: I want to get back to StubHub a little bit later. But first, I want to ask you about digital revolution and maybe income inequality that perhaps comes from that. I mean, you live in Silicon Valley. I just came back from it, and there is a real haves and have-nots, people driving Teslas, and then there's homeless people sleeping under the highway underpasses. What was the cause of that, and how can that be addressed? And does Silicon Valley play a role there?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Yeah. Well, for sure Silicon Valley has a role to play. Because I think as we pointed out, you can't talk about being the promoter of innovation without also thinking about the repercussions. And as we know, the income inequality divide is getting bigger, not smaller.

So does big tech have a role to play? Absolutely. And I think-- look. There are some good examples to look at. Let's look at Marc Benioff and Salesforce and his advocation for big tech paying their fair share in order to help solve the homelessness problem. There's some examples of what good might look like. I think we would agree that's not universally true. And that is for sure a responsibility of big tech as well.

ANDY SERWER: And just drifting into the political realm a little bit, Sukhinder--


ANDY SERWER: --and your favorite. What about proposals by some of the people running for president on the Democratic side, for instance, Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders and AOC saying it's going to tax the rich and the rich are immoral.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Yeah. Look, I mean, I am for sure a capitalist who believes that innovation comes from open markets. Open markets doesn't mean your absolute responsibility, but it also doesn't mean that the solve to all of these things is a universal tax. I mean, I think we want to do things that promote innovation. And I think we want to be responsible stewards. And I will always walk that line.

ANDY SERWER: Another topic-- women in tech. You are one of the few high-profile women leaders in the space. And people are saying it's terrible-- there's no progress-- there's little progress. Is that really the case?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: It's interesting, because I'm a pragmatic optimist but I've learned to be a realist. And so what do I mean by that? I think you-- you and I met many, many years ago. I've been in the Valley for 20 years. And largely speaking, I believe it has been one of the more merocratic places for me to be. I arrived as a 27-year-old with no business running anything, let alone a company, and got the opportunity to start one and then several. And also got opportunities to be at some of the great companies in the Valley.

So on the one hand, I believe that if you want to take control of your destiny, there is less hierarchy. There is the opportunity to be measured by what you do. All of that is true. It can also be true that the opportunity to take advantage of all of the talent potential in women is not being realized. And we see that in places where, quite frankly-- in the absence of-- where we see a system of meritocracy still being subject to unconscious bias. That's what I would put it. It doesn't mean that if you're in a merocratic system that there isn't still the opportunity for gender bias, unconscious bias, bias in funding, and all of these things.

So on the one hand, if you say, has it progressed over the last 20 years? I would say yes. I would say when I first started a company, Yodlee, in 1999-- I think it was 1999-- I couldn't find another female founder anywhere.

ANDY SERWER: 20 years ago.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Right, 20 years ago. And we look at it today. And we look at not only the female founders-- the female founders running unicorns-- Rent the Runway, Stitch Fix, The RealReal-- which has just filed for IPO-- Eventbrite, Houzz. I mean, unicorns that have been started and funded and founded by women.

And then we look at the state of women in venture capital. And we can see progress as women are not just partners at first, but they're running firms-- Theresa [? Raab, ?] Theresia Gouw, or Aileen Lee, the women at Freestyle Capital. I mean, I could go on. So you could say, on a absolute basis, there's progress. On a relative basis, the numbers are still frickin' tiny. And that's why people, I think, continue to be discouraged.

My own point of view is we have progress-- we need to accelerate progress. And the place I think there's the most opportunity-- are some of the areas I'm passionate about. Number one, women in every part of a company's ecosystem, not just as women in STEM-- which is the often-used narrative for women in tech. I care about women in the boardroom. I care about building diverse pipelines. I care about dispelling the myth that today there isn't enough talent.

And then I think we think about-- I think a lot about policies that make it more possible for women to stay in at the middle part of their career.

ANDY SERWER: Is theBoardlist-- does that endeavor speak to this problem?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: For sure it does, because I think it--

ANDY SERWER: Talk about what theBoardlist is.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Yeah. And I'll talk about what it is in a moment. It speaks to it because it's a technology solution designed to help solve the gender gap for very real business issues in the boardroom. And I say it's indicative of this, because I think theBoardlist recognizes there's a problem.

But on the other end, the platform itself is a platform of possibility. It says, these people are out there. You just need to find-- have a good way to surface the great talent that exists, that should be in the boardroom. So theBoardlist is a platform I started in 2015. Think of it as LinkedIn for boards. It is designed to be a place where great, diverse talent is both nominated by experienced CEOs and board members for the boardroom, and then companies who are looking for diverse talent go to theBoardlist to find a great board member.

And it is a platform that was started in Silicon Valley, but has now gone far beyond tech. We serve companies large and small, in every industry. We serve searches for digital and non-digital board members, and we think we're a good breeding ground for companies starting earlier in the diversity search, and putting women on their boards earlier, and putting diversity on the boards much earlier in their lifecycle, which is an important phenomena.

ANDY SERWER: And you're still involved in this, with your full time job?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: I'm not the CEO. I was never the CEO, but I'm the founder and chairman.

ANDY SERWER: So talk to us about StubHub. You came about a year ago to become president.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: About a year ago. Yeah.

ANDY SERWER: Why did you take the job? What are you looking to do? What have you accomplished? What do you still need to do?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Oh, gosh. All great questions. So why did I go? First of all, you know I'm a consumer internet junkie, and I spent the majority of my career at consumer internet companies. But I would say at this stage of my career, where I work or what I work on is as important as just being involved in innovation.

And so when I was looking at my next gig, starting Joyus and theBoardlist, I was really looking for a platform that gives people joy at scale-- lives in the want economy as opposed to the needs economy that was one characteristic for me. Number two, global. Number three, a sector that's growing. And number four, a place where I felt a combination of maybe scale and entrepreneurial mindset-- was maybe the unique combination that any platform I would go to needed at that point in its history.

And so you look at StubHub, and you're like, global? Yes. We serve 44 countries, 100 million visitors a year. Need versus want economy? We're squarely in the want economy. And in a sector that's growing-- live experiences is where not just millennials but even you and I are spending more amounts of our income-- so growing category. Give people joy? Yeah, that's our mission, every day.

So it's a good reason to get up and go to work. And at this point in my life, unfortunately, I'm old enough where that really matters. It's not just innovation for innovation's sake. And the combination of scale and hustle, that probably comes to your next question, which is what have I done while I'm there.

Yeah. On the one hand, StubHub is a 19-year-old business, which is hard to imagine. But in a sector that's growing, it quite frankly has faced a lot of increased competition and innovation in the last few years. So StubHub has always been the pioneer for the customer, but what does that mean today? And so, when I think about where I've spent my time over the past year at StubHub, it's been probably in four key areas. I think they're all focused on growth, but in different ways.

Number one, I think about the leadership that we need in this next generation of the company, and how do we think about innovation at scale and globally. So I changed out almost half-- more than half-- of my executive team. Number two, areas of growth and opportunity-- international. I ran international at Google.

And for StubHub, live experiences internationally is a even faster growing market than it is in the US. You can think of everything from the traveling customer-- I mean, we're seeing more than ever-- NBA games abroad. Chinese customers traveling all over the world to have unique experiences with incredible disposable income. International just represents a whole new growth area for StubHub. So that's been the second area of focus for me.

Number one, doubling down on the core business. The reality is, is that as we talked about, the landscape in ticketing continues to evolve-- and so, just lots of efforts to innovate at the core. And then lastly, culture and purpose. I mean, it's one of the things we'll talk about today. How do you take the same joyful experience we're trying to give customers and create a next generation culture at StubHub where people get up every day excited to innovate because they're there for the why of their job. And so those have been the four areas that I'm focused on.

ANDY SERWER: Now, the company is not without some controversy. I mean, first of all, you have an activist investor, Elliott Management, who's coming in, rattling your cage. So I want to ask you about that. And then also, this whole independent ticket brokers thing-- and then the state and federal laws that people say is being arbitraged. So I want to address both those things.

First of all, what's going on with Elliott Management? They want to be spun out of the company. They want board members, all that. You guys-- the company has responded to an extent.


ANDY SERWER: Where does that stand?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: So to be fair, Elliott Management is an active investor in eBay-- which is our parent company. And has made a number of public recommendations to eBay, including a strategic review of its portfolio, which includes StubHub. That's going on right now. They also joined the board, and I think came to agreement with eBay on the actions eBay would take. And so I think it's been constructive and it's ongoing, so strategic review ongoing.

ANDY SERWER: Is the company going to be spun off?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: No answer, no conclusion, nothing to share right now-- but an agreement that eBay would do a strategic review. In terms of where we sit in the ecosystem-- look, I think that people love to look at ticketing as this controversial thing. And obviously, when StubHub started it was.

Let's be super clear. Our brand is built on a fan first mentality. And that means several things. Number one, it means that fans want access. At the end of the day, fans want to be able to go to an event when they want, how they want, the way they want-- on their mobile phone, have a ticket that's safe and secure, and they want last minute access. So this idea that a resale market for ticketing is going to go away, I'm like, what we see more than ever is-- I mean, are you going to sit-- are you going to leave this meeting right now and go sit at your computer and wait for an on sale so that you can get a ticket the minute it's posted?

No. You're going to make the decision to go to an event, probably today, for tomorrow or for next week. And you want access. And so our job is to provide a safe and trusted marketplace for that. I think when we talk about our second responsiblity to the consumer, it's making sure that's a safe and trusted experience-- which includes working with sellers on policies that are transparent, making sure that tickets get fulfilled. By the way, it includes working with regulators, as we do in many markets, including here in New York-- on making sure that fans always have access.

We were a big proponent of the paperless ticket law that passed here in New York a couple of years ago. And we were just at the FTC hearings this week. And we think our third job for the consumer is transparency. I think we pride ourselves on not just providing a trusted experience-- an experience that gives access when you want it. We also pride ourselves on being transparent about what we do.

And so whether that's in the UK where we work with the CMA, or here at FCC [? hearings-- ?] I think, we feel pretty secure that as long as we stay true to the fan, we'll be in a good place.

ANDY SERWER: Just to follow up on that, should state and federal laws regulating--


ANDY SERWER: -- the market, should they be stronger, weaker, the same? What do you think?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Mostly, what I think-- even with regard to ticketing-- is what I said earlier, with regard to the open market. So fortunately or unfortunately, not every actor has the same ethos towards ticketing as we do. So I think you find in many states there is monitoring, if not regulation. And I would say, generally speaking, I'm in fan of anything that gives consumers protection and consumer transparency. So if you say, is there a role for consumer advocacy groups to play, or regulators around consumer advocacy? For sure.

Number two, are there issues of potential anti-competitive behavior, even in our industry? Yes. Are we a fan of seeing those monitored and addressed? Yes.

So I think from both perspectives, I would-- am I looking to wake up and be regulated? No. Do we work pretty actively, in every state, with regulators? The answer is yes-- and sometimes proactively to make sure that the customer interest is stewarded.

ANDY SERWER: What other things are you looking to do for customers? Do you have something called TicketForward? Do you have a loyalty program?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Yeah, we're going to talk about it. You got it. Thank you for asking, Andy.

ANDY SERWER: Tell us about this.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Bingo. There we go. So look, I think as we chat about that journey at StubHub-- if the first year was about ensuring international growth, stabilizing, and optimizing the core business, think about the leadership team, and reinvigorating the culture. When you think forward to what we have always represented for the fans, it is always both the fan first mentality and being the first in our industry to do the things that are right for fans.

So what do we have coming next? Number one, on the social purpose side, we are launching TicketForward or have launched TicketForward, which is our global social good program where anybody can get the joy of life. So this started in our own organization. We were like, wow, how do we feel the brand every day? And you and I both know that we live in a virtuous cycle where sometimes it's great to receive, sometimes it's great to give. And giving something like a live experience is a pretty special thing.

So we started a program internally, where we allow employees to nominate-- took off. Then we partnered with Make-A-Wish globally, because when you think about being able to gift tickets to people in need or people who are inspired, what better organization than someone like Make-A-Wish that helps us do it publicly. And today we're announcing TicketForward globally, which has not only those two components-- but the third component, which is opening up this virtuous cycle to our fans.

So allowing our fans, partner organizations, the teams we work with-- all to be able to nominate great people for their communities to be gifted a live experience. So it takes that virtuous cycle that we live inside of StubHub and takes it outside of our four walls and allows our fans to join that experience-- which we're pretty excited about. And partner orgs, like I said, including Make-A-Wish.

The second thing comes to that other piece. If we're going to be first for fans, it's not just on things like social purpose. Great, of course, they would look to us for that. But when you think about the fan experience, we were the first to provide a fan protect guarantee. We were the first provide mobile ticket access along all of baseball. We were the first to provide 3D maps.

Well, I think the other first for us is really going to a full-fledged loyalty program-- the first tryouts of which is launching for our top-tier customers, called StubHub Beyond-- which really packages up an experience for fans that they expect from StubHub already into unique services that we provide for our top customers. That really shows that going to an experience through StubHub is far more than a ticket. So it includes premium concierge service, early access to events.

A first in the industry is refund protection-- for our top buyers to be able to actually refund a ticket-- which doesn't exist in our industry today. So the announce of StubHub Beyond is one step forward in our desire to be first for our fans.

ANDY SERWER: Sounds like a lot of work there. I do want to shift gears, though, and ask you a little bit about your background and some of these other places that you've worked. So you grew up in Tanzania, or were born there, at least.


ANDY SERWER: So how did you get from there to where you are today? I mean, I know it's a whole long, strange trip--

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Convoluted story, right. But the Cliff Notes?

ANDY SERWER: In other words, so are there ways for people to be born in a place like that and get to where you are today? And how does that happen? Just generally.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Yeah, it's a good question. So I was born in Tanzania to two doctors-- two Indian doctors. My parents were-- both ran a medical practice together there and immigrated to Canada when I was two. And then ran a medical practice together in Canada for 20, 30 years.

So first of all, if you think of the through line, the one clear through line and I think research supports the same is-- often entrepreneurs and entrepreneurial people experience entrepreneurship in their family. And although my parents are doctors and you don't think of that as entrepreneurs, my father loved running a small biz. Let me say that he loved it. He just loved it.

So by the time I was seven or eight--

ANDY SERWER: The billing, all the other [INAUDIBLE].

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: All of that. By the time I was seven or eight, I was literally doing his ledger for his taxes. By the time I was probably 11 or 12, I probably knew how to do his tax returns. My first job was in his office. And he always told me to work for myself. The other funny story about my dad is-- besides loving entrepreneurship generally, and loving running a small business-- he actually loved technology.

And so, long before I ever knew anything about this industry, I distinctly remember-- which I tell people, I was probably 15 or 16, and my dad would call his broker. You remember the days when you'd call your broker to trade stocks? My dad loved to trade stocks. And he'd call up his broker and his eyesight was going because he was older. And he had his magnifying glass and he was looking at the paper. And he calls his broker every day to talk stocks, and he'd be like-- he'd be like, "Tom! Let's buy some of this company, AOL."

We're in the AOL Building right now, 30 years later. I didn't even know what AOL was, and here's this older doctor who spends all day treating people-- loves stocks, loves Wall Street, loves innovation-- has discovered this company called AOL and is buying stock. And I'm listening.

And so you say, what's the gap from there to here? Well, I think I had a lot of exposure to entrepreneurship. Obviously, I had the benefit of a very secure financial environment, which allowed me to take risks. And I don't think we want to underestimate the power of that.

And I would say, from my very first job-- no surprise, was on Wall Street. My dad was like, hey, go down to New York and interview and trying to get a job at that place called Merrill Lynch. And I did. And by the time I was in my 20s, I wanted to be an entrepreneur. By the time I was in my 30s, I was an entrepreneur in tech. And I think you could trace it all back to that origin story.

ANDY SERWER: So you worked for these big companies. You work for eBay now. You've worked at Google a little bit. You worked at Amazon. You've started up companies. You've worked at startups.

So what is the common denominator, Sukhinder across those-- that allows you to succeed?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: I think there are probably two things. And by the way, I haven't always succeeded. There's been lots of failure. And there are lots of things that didn't work out.

ANDY SERWER: But keep moving forward.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: But let's call it progress-- progress over a long period of time, even if not in every single case. I think that maybe the two through lines for me are number one, always been building. Even when I was at Google, I was building. First local and maps, and then I built the international business. So there's never been a time I've been-- at Amazon, I was in the first iteration of Marketplace, which was through an acquisition of a company called Junglee that I was at. So I've never not been a builder.

And I don't think-- I think there are very few times-- StubHub may be the rare exception where I inherited something at scale already. And I'm trying to take it to its next chapter of growth-- but always a builder.

Number two, I think the other thing that's allowed me to succeed is-- and I look for it in the people I hire, whether they're junior, whether they're senior-- which is, I've always had what I call operating range-- which is, I can see where we need to go. And I can put myself at 30,000 feet, and then I can roll up my sleeves and be like, OK, well, what needs to happen today?

And then I can get into the weeds and be like, actually, if we want to start a company we need to go get some office space and I need to hire-- I need to hire a lawyer and do it cheap. So I think throughout my career, whether big or small, I've always been somebody who likes to go up, go down, get into the details, go back up. And I look for people that can move pretty seamlessly between vision and execution. And so I think I've been lucky that that's something I've gotten to do.

ANDY SERWER: How long do you want to keep doing this? I mean, you ever think about it, like why do you do this? What are you getting out of this?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Well, don't we all hope we're getting impact? Why are you doing this?

ANDY SERWER: Same thing.

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Impact, right? I mean, I think that-- well, first of all, I guess I uniquely believe that if I want to have impact in the world I don't need to-- I mean, I have theBoardlist thing, but I didn't do theBoardlist because I was searching for impact. I feel like I have impact every day in my day job. If I can create something that's an experience that millions of people love, and if I can create a place where people's careers are accelerated, and people experience satisfaction and success-- I feel like as a leader, that's also part of impact.

So at this stage, I'm just doing it for impact. And as we talked about, I'd rather be impactful in areas that I'm passionate about or enjoy personally as a consumer. And StubHub fits that bill.

ANDY SERWER: Do you think about how you are influencing the world or influencing younger people or influencing the world around you in terms of the people who work for you?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: I don't spend every day thinking about it. I mean, people tell me that and it's gratifying. And obviously, I intrinsically believe that, or at this stage of my career, I would not be spending my time doing the things I'm doing. Do I actively think about it? No. Do I feel-- I go through my day every day trying to do those things.

ANDY SERWER: How do you want to use your influence then?

SUKHINDER SINGH CASSIDY: Yeah, I guess that's probably-- I mean, when people say you have influence, I'm like-- I think you wake up every day and try. And I think you try and do your best work. And at some point, when you add all that up over a very long period of working, you naturally get to some influence.

How do I think about using my influence? I think mostly right now, I think-- I don't need money to have influence. I think I just feel like my influence is like, look. Can you help people see possibility and realize it? And I think if I can do that in every aspect of my life-- at theBoardlist, with my children-- I want them to think that anything's possible and they can go get it-- for women, at StubHub, for fans-- I just feel like right now impact for me equals-- and influence is like, do you see the world as a place where anything's possible, and can you help accelerate possibility for other people?

And I'm like, I feel like if I can do that, I'm good.

ANDY SERWER: That's great. Sukhinder, thank you so much for joining us today.


ANDY SERWER: Sukhinder Singh Cassidy. You've been watching "Influencers," I'm Andy Serwer. We'll see you next time.